Native Americans Who Can\'t Afford Heat Take Desperate Measures To Stay Warm

Still denying the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics, and still ignorant of the fact that radiation by itself does not mean a transfer of thermal energy. Pathetic.

One reply to you. Here’s the science that proves you wrong. You have never refuted any of it. You lose, AGAIN, just like you have lost every time you deny the 1st & 2nd Laws.

All these references show that your ridiculous claim that the

cold atmosphere transfers more thermal energy (333W/m²) to the Earth’s surface than the Sun does(168W/m²) does is wrong. Peer reviewed science which was written explicitly from the perspective of the 2nd Law and climate, Ozawa(2003)’The Second Law of Thermodynamics and the Global Climate System’, shows the real Earth energy balance: https://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/3163/2606/original.jpg It shows NO thermal energy flux/flow/transfer from the cold atmosphere to the warmer surface of the Earth, because that would violate the 2nd Law.

Your mental model doesn’t change the real world fact that thermal energy/heat is only transferred from hotter objects to colder objects. That pesky 2nd Law, that you deny still rules in the real world that we live in. No temperature difference, NO energy transfer!

“Consider two objects at different temperatures that are brought together. Energy is transferred from the hotter one to the cooler one, until both objects reach thermal equilibrium (ie., both become the same temperature). … The transfer of energy is caused by the temperature difference, and

ceases once the temperatures are equal.” – https://www.boundless.com/physics/textbooks/boundless-physics-textbook/heat-and-heat-transfer-13/introduction-110/heat-as-energy-transfer-390-10942/ online Physics Textbook

I’ll show you just some of the dozens of science references again that prove you wrong again. Study harder. I’m not playing your trolling game. I’ve already proven you wrong, the dozens of science references have already proven you wrong, and the real world has proven you wrong. You lose.

Study this article which you have never refuted, https://okulaer.wordpress.com/2015/02/19/to-heat-a-planetary-surface-for-dummies-part-4/ , especially the first graphic that shows that the energy transfer between two objects radiating at teach other is defined by the

resultant blue combined EM wave . No temperature difference, no energy transfer because the resultant blue wave is a standing wave which neither travels nor carries any energy in either direction.

“If you have a source emitting an EM wave through a certain space and another source emitting another EM wave through the same space at the same frequency, but in the opposite direction, you get a standing wave. A standing wave does not travel or carry energy, so its average Poynting vector is zero. You can think of it as the Poynting vector of the one wave canceling the other.” – PhysicsForums, https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/cancellation-of-poynting-vector-components.507450/

Your silly claim of continuous, 100% efficient, lossless transfer of energy back and forth as if the other object was at absolute zero (but it’s not, it’s at the same temperature so there is NO energy flow) violates the universal entropy principle which has never been shown to be violated. This reference explains it:

Entropy and the Second Law of Thermodynamics: … How the Universe Works … In trying to synthesize the ideas of Kelvin, Joule, and Carnot – that is, that energy is conserved in thermodynamic processes and that

heat always “flows downhill” in temperature – Rudolf Clausius invented the idea of entropy in such a way that the change in entropy is the ratio of the heat exchanged in any process and the absolute temperature at which that heat is exchanged. That is, he defined the change in entropy DS of an object which either absorbs or gives off heat Q at some temperature T as simply the ratio Q/T. With this new concept, he was able to put the idea that heat will always flow from the higher to the lower temperature into a mathematical framework. If a quantity of heat Q flows naturally from a higher temperature object to a lower temperature object – something that we ALWAYS observe, the entropy gained by the cooler object during the transfer is greater than the entropy lost by the warmer one since Q/Tc.>|Q|/Th. So he could state that the principle that drives all natural thermodynamic processes is that the effect of any heat transfer is a net increase in the combined entropy of the two objects. And that new principle establishes

THE direction that natural processes proceed. All natural processes occur in such a way that the total entropy of the universe increases. The only heat transfer that could occur and leave the entropy of the universe unchanged is one that occurs between two objects which are at the same temperature –

but that is not possible, since no heat would transfer . So a reversible isothermal heat transfer that would leave the entropy of the universe constant is just an idealization –

and hence could not occur . All other processes – meaning, all real processes – have the effect of increasing the entropy of the universe. That is the second law of thermodynamics.” – California Polytechnic State University, http://www.calpoly.edu/~rbrown/entropy.html

The only way to prove your claim correct is to experimentally demonstrate a working backradiation collector that collects twice as much thermal energy/heat as a solar collector and collects just as much thermal energy/heat at night as a solar collector does during the daytime. Got it working? No, you haven’t, so the real world proves you wrong:

“Compare it with experiment or experience, compare it directly with observations to see if it works.

If it disagrees with experiment it’s wrong . In that simple statement is the key to science. It doesn’t make any difference how beautiful your guess is, it doesn’t make any difference how smart you are, who made the guess, or what his name is,

if it disagrees with experiment, it’s WRONG!

That’s all there is to it. ” – Physicist Richard Feynman, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b240PGCMwV0

This simple heat transfer example proves your claim that colder objects transfer thermal energy to hotter objects is wrong because your wrong understanding ends up violating the 1st Law conservation of energy, as well as violating the 2nd Law because it has the increase in temperature of the object resulting from the transfer of heat from the colder radiation shield to the warmer object: https://disqus.com/home/discussion/thedailycaller/httpdailycallercom20170328exxon_urges_trump_to_stay_in_paris_climate_agreement/#comment-3244026340 You have never refuted this example that proves you wrong.

Then study these 3 dozen science references which prove you wrong again. You have never refuted a single one of them:

• “the second law involves the fact that processes proceed in a certain direction but

not in the opposite direction. A hot cup of coffee cools by virtue of heat transfer to the surroundings, but heat will

not flow from the cooler surroundings to the hotter cup of coffee.” – Fundamentals of Classical Thermodynamics, VanWylen and Sonntag, Chap.6 ‘The Second Law of Thermodynamics’, p.155

• “Transfer of Energy from the Ocean to the Atmosphere. – Heat moves in predictable ways, flowing from warmer objects to cooler ones, until both reach the same temperature.” – http://oceanservice.noaa.gov/education/pd/oceans_weather_climate/energy_oceans_atmosphere.html

• “Heat energy is transferred as a result of a temperature difference. Energy as heat passes FROM a warm body with higher temperature TO a cold body with lower temperature. The transfer of energy as a result of temperature difference alone is referred to as HEAT FLOW.” – http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/heat-work-energy-d_292.html

• “Heat does not flow from a cooler to warmer body.” – Clark2010 ‘A Null Hypothesis for CO2’ , peer reviewed science

• “if the temperature of one object is higher than that of the other object, there will be a transfer of energy from the hotter to the colder object until both objects reach the same temperature.” – http://coolcosmos.ipac.caltech.edu/cosmic_classroom/light_lessons/thermal/differ.html , NASA & California Institute of Technology

• “When you put a hot object in contact with a cold one, heat will flow FROM the warmer TO the cooler. As a result, the warmer one will usually cool down and the cooler one will usually warm up. Eventually they will reach the same temperature and

heat flow will stop .” – http://hop.concord.org/h1/phys/h1pf.html , Hands on Physics – Heat and Temperature

• “Heat flows from hot to cold – The first statement of the 2nd Law of thermodynamics – heat flows spontaneously FROM a hot TO a cold body” – http://theory.uwinnipeg.ca/mod_tech/node79.html , Univ of Winnipeg, Canada

• “this would involve the spontaneous transfer of heat from a cool object to a hot one, in violation of the 2nd Law” – http://theory.uwinnipeg.ca/mod_tech/node79.html , Univ of Winnipeg, Canada

• “Whenever there is a temperature difference between two objects in contact, heat energy will flow FROM the warmer object TO the cooler object until they reach the same temperature.” – http://faculty.wwu.edu/vawter/PhysicsNet/Topics/Thermal/HeatFlow.html , Western Washington Univ , Heat Flow

• “Consider two objects at different temperatures that are brought together. Energy is transferred from the hotter one to the cooler one, until both objects reach thermal equilibrium (ie., both become the same temperature). … The transfer of energy is caused by the temperature difference, and

ceases once the temperatures are equal.” – https://www.boundless.com/physics/textbooks/boundless-physics-textbook/heat-and-heat-transfer-13/introduction-110/heat-as-energy-transfer-390-10942/ online Physics Textbook

• “In the process of reaching thermodynamic equilibrium, heat is transferred FROM the warmer object TO the cooler object. At thermodynamic equilibrium

heat transfer is ZERO .” – http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/k-12/airplane/Images/heat.gif , NASA – Heat Transfer

• “the laws of thermodynamics lay the framework for the science of heat transfer. … The second law

requires that heat be transferred in the DIRECTION OF DECREASING TEMPERATURE. It is analogous to the electric current flowing in the direction of decreasing voltage or the fluid flowing in the direction of decreasing pressure.” – http://web.archive.org/web/20150610140851/http://www.cdeep.iitb.ac.in/nptel/Mechanical/Heat%20and%20Mass%20Transfer/Conduction/Module%201/main/1.2.html , India Institute of Technology (the MIT/Stanford of India)

• “Heat transfer is energy in transit due to temperature difference. Whenever there exists a temperature difference in a medium or between media, heat transfer must occur. The basic requirement for heat transfer is the presence of temperature difference.

There can be NO net heat transfer between two mediums that are at the same temperature . The temperature is the driving force for heat transfer, just as the voltage difference is the driving force for electric current flow and pressure difference is the driving force for fluid flow. The rate of heat transfer in a certain direction depends on the magnitude of the temperature gradient (the temperature difference per unit length or the rate of change of temperature) in that direction. The larger the temperature gradient, the higher the rate of heat transfer.” – http://web.archive.org/web/20150528053416/http://www.cdeep.iitb.ac.in/nptel/Mechanical/Heat%20and%20Mass%20Transfer/Conduction/Module%201/main/1.3.1.html , India Institute of Technology

• Lecture on 2nd Law & Perpetual Motion Machines of the 2nd Kind – http://www.myopencourses.com/video/l10-second-law-of-thermodynamics-heat-engines-refrigerators-and-heat-pumps-kelvin-planck-and-clausiu

• “When you bring two objects of different temperature together, energy will ALWAYS be transferred FROM the hotter object TO the cooler object. The objects will exchange thermal energy until thermal equilibrium is reached, ie., until their temperatures are equal. We say heat flows FROM the hotter object TO the cooler object. Heat is energy on the move. … Without an external agent doing work, heat will ALWAYS flow from a hotter to a cooler object.” – http://electron6.phys.utk.edu/101/CH7/Heat%20Flow.htm , Univ of Tenn Physics

• “heat is simply the transfer of energy from a hot object to a colder object. … Just as in the case of the cooling coffee mug, energy is being transferred from the higher temperature objects to the lower temperature object. Once more, this is known as heat – the transfer of energy from the higher temperature object to a lower temperature object.” – http://www.physicsclassroom.com/class/thermalP/Lesson-1/What-is-Heat , Physics Classroom

• “If there is a temperature difference in a system, heat will naturally move from high to low temperatures. The place you find the higher temperature is the heat source. The area where the temperature is lower is the heat sink.” – http://www.physics4kids.com/files/thermo_transfer.html , Physics 4 Kids

• “We’re going to talk about the 2nd law of thermodynamics here. … Heat flows from hot areas to cold, NOT the other way.” , http://www.physics4kids.com/files/thermo_law2.html , Physics 4 Kids

• “Heat moves from one system because of differences of temperature in the systems. If you have two identical systems with equal temperatures, there will be NO flow of energy. When you have two systems with different temperatures, the energy will start to flow. … Areas of high temperature give off energy TO areas of lower temperature.” – http://www.physics4kids.com/files/thermo_intro.html , Physics 4 Kids

• “When two things are in thermal contact but NO thermal energy is exchanged between them, they’re in thermal equilibrium. If two things are in thermal equilibrium, they have the SAME temperature.” – http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/transferring-heat-through-radiation.html

• “Entropy and the Second Law of Thermodynamics: … How the Universe Works … In trying to synthesize the ideas of Kelvin, Joule, and Carnot – that is, that energy is conserved in thermodynamic processes and that

heat always “flows downhill” in temperature – Rudolf Clausius invented the idea of entropy in such a way that the change in entropy is the ratio of the heat exchanged in any process and the absolute temperature at which that heat is exchanged. That is, he defined the change in entropy DS of an object which either absorbs or gives off heat Q at some temperature T as simply the ratio Q/T. With this new concept, he was able to put the idea that heat will always flow from the higher to the lower temperature into a mathematical framework. If a quantity of heat Q flows naturally from a higher temperature object to a lower temperature object – something that we ALWAYS observe, the entropy gained by the cooler object during the transfer is greater than the entropy lost by the warmer one since Q/Tc.>|Q|/Th. So he could state that the principle that drives all natural thermodynamic processes is that the effect of any heat transfer is a net increase in the combined entropy of the two objects. And that new principle establishes THE direction that natural processes proceed. All natural processes occur in such a way that the total entropy of the universe increases. The only heat transfer that could occur and leave the entropy of the universe unchanged is one that occurs between two objects which are at the same temperature – but that is not possible,

since no heat would transfer . So a reversible isothermal heat transfer that would leave the entropy of the universe constant is just an idealization – and hence could not occur. All other processes – meaning, all real processes – have the effect of increasing the entropy of the universe. That is the second law of thermodynamics.” – California Polytechnic State University, http://www.calpoly.edu/~rbrown/entropy.html

“Stefan-Boltzmann for Two Blackbodies consider a blackbody B1 of temperature T1 in radiative contact with another blackbody B2 of temperature T2 with T2 > T1 … Q₁₂ = σ(T₂⁴ – T₁⁴) with T₂>T₁. which expresses Stefan-Boltzmann’s Law for the radiative heat transfer from one body in radiative contact with a body of lower temperature. … Notice the requirement in (14.3) that T₂>T₁. In the literature one finds the law without this requirement in the form Q₁₂ = σT₂⁴ – σT₁⁴ , Q₂₁ = σT₁⁴ – σT₂^⁴ = -Q₁₂ (14.5) where Q₂₁ is the heat transfer from B₁ to B₂ as the negative of Q₂₁ .

This form has led to the misinterpretation of Stefan-Boltzmann’s Law as expressing heat transfer from B2 to B1 of size σT₂^⁴ balanced by a transfer of -σT₁⁴ from B₁ to B₂, as if two opposing transfers of heat energy is taking place between the two bodies with their difference determining the net flow. Such a misinterpretation was anticipated an countered in Stefan’s original article [42][Ueber die Beziehung zwischen der Warmestrahlung und der Temperatur (Concerning the relationship between the Thermal radiation and the Temperature)] from 1879:

” • The absolute value the heat energy emission from a radiating body cannot be determined by experiment. An experiment can only determine the surplus of emission over absorption, with the absorption determined by the emission from the environment of the body.

• However, if one has a formula for the emission as a function of temperature (like Stefan-Boltzmann Law), then the absolute value of the emission can be determined, but such a formula has only a

hypothetical meaning .”

Stefan-Boltzmann’s Law (14.3) thus requires T₂>T₁ and

does not contain two-way opposing heat transfer, only one-way heat transfer from warm to cold . Unfortunately the misinterpretation has led to a fictitious non-physical “backradiation” underlying CO2 global warming alarmism.” – Johnson2012

• Promoters of CAGW-by-CO2’s misunderstanding of S-B is also explained here: http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com/2014/11/okulaer-on-why-atmospheric-radiative.html

• Further explanation of the errors of CAGW-by-CO2 alarmists’ understanding of thermodynamics: http://climateofsophistry.com/2015/01/21/atmosphere-not-insulation/

Then study this:

Any object above zero has a radiation force/power field, and has the potential to transfer heat energy, but can only do so if the other object is at a lower energy state, ie., a lower temperature, than the first object.

This shows that a surface has an “emissive power” that has an “upper limit”. That upper limit is only reached if the 2nd object is at absolute zero, as the equation shows. If the other object is at the same temperature, the emissive powers cancel and there is NO heat transfer, as my multiple sources state. – http://web.archive.org/web/20150510195517/http://www.cdeep.iitb.ac.in/nptel/Mechanical/Heat%20and%20Mass%20Transfer/Conduction/Module%201/main/1.4.3.html

WolframResearch says: “Radiation pressure is defined as the

force per unit area exerted by electromagnetic radiation” – http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/physics/RadiationPressure.html

Heat energy spontaneously flows only in one direction, from higher energy states to lower energy states. To do otherwise would violate the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics.

“this would involve the spontaneous transfer of heat from a cool object to a hot one, in violation of the 2nd Law” – http://theory.uwinnipeg.ca/mod_tech/node79.html

The fact that emissive powers of two objects which are at exactly the same temperature cancel is evident because heat flow goes to ZERO. That means the emissive power transfers NO heat energy from either object to the other object when the temperature of the two objects is exactly the same. That is effectively cancelling the emissive power of one surface by an equal but opposite emissive power of the other surface.

“With radiation, electromagnetic waves carry the energy.” – http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/transferring-heat-through-radiation.html

Waves can cancel or reflect back. “the superposition of a wave that has an electric field in one direction (positive) in space and time with a wave of the same frequency having an electric field in the opposite direction (negative) in space and time leads to cancellation and no resultant wave at all (zero intensity). … out-of-phase superposition yielding zero intensity, is destructive interference.” – http://web.archive.org/web/20150621090852/http://www.britannica.com/science/electromagnetic-radiation/Superposition-and-interference

Look at the electromagnetic wave vector slide, http://physics.info/em-waves/poynting.svg . You see the poynting vectors that AlecM describes. Two facing surfaces at equal temperatures have equal frequency and equal amplitude electric, magnetic, and poynting vectors, but in opposite directions. All the vectors cancel out, and there is no heat energy flow/transfer.

The entire reference of that slide is here: http://physics.info/em-waves/ Go to the end where it talks about radiation pressure, similar to the WolframResource reference that I cited, http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/physics/RadiationPressure.html . Equal but opposite radiation pressure results in no heat energy flow. Equal but opposite radiation force results in no heat energy flow.

• “If you have a source emitting an EM wave through a certain space and another source emitting another EM wave through the same space at the same frequency, but in the opposite direction, you get a standing wave. A standing wave does not travel or carry energy, so its average Poynting vector is zero. You can think of it as the Poynting vector of the one wave canceling the other.” – PhysicsForums, https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/cancellation-of-poynting-vector-components.507450/

• “But the internal energy of a system is still proportional to its temperature. We can therefore monitor changes in the internal energy of a system by watching what happens to the temperature of the system. Whenever the temperature of the system increases we can conclude that the internal energy of the system has also increased.” – Purdue Univ., http://chemed.chem.purdue.edu/genchem/topicreview/bp/ch21/chemical.php

Some 2nd Law deniers admit that heat doesn’t flow from colder objects to warmer objects, but that energy does. This is nonsense, since heat is energy in transit:

• “Heat may be defined as

energy in transit from a high temperature object to a lower temperature object. An object does not possess “heat”; the appropriate term for the microscopic energy in an object is internal energy. The internal energy may be increased by transferring

energy to the object from a higher temperature (hotter) object – this is properly called

heating .” – Georgia State Univ. Physics & Astronomy, http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/thermo/heat.html

You lose, AGAIN!

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